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Pro Rules Too Strict
PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2004 9:56 pm Reply with quote
Guest
 


I'm getting a little tired of being disabled due to "pro rules" when I'm the one getting rammed into from the side. Does anyone else feel this way, or do you think I'm just whining?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2004 10:00 pm Reply with quote
Taxmgr
 
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 5


This was my post. I'm not sure why my login name wasn't used.
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Re: Pro Rules Too Strict
PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:36 am Reply with quote
Flexman
 
Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 59
Location: Graz, Austria


Anonymous wrote:
I'm getting a little tired of being disabled due to "pro rules" when I'm the one getting rammed into from the side. Does anyone else feel this way, or do you think I'm just whining?

I don't have a problem with that myself but I think that that pro mode should be improved.

It is possible to drive backwards (if you don't crash of course), while you get disabled when somone who overlaps you crahes into your car from behind. If cups are with 4 laps then this happens sometimes, but if a race is 6 laps like on the demo server this happens quite often.

Would be fine if the game can detect if someone crashes from behind or frontal and only disables overlapped car if someone really is blocking all the time.
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Re: Pro Rules Too Strict
PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:50 am Reply with quote
Ande
 
Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 121


Flexman wrote:

Would be fine if the game can detect if someone crashes from behind or frontal and only disables overlapped car if someone really is blocking all the time.


It is really hard to define what is meaned by "blocking all the time". If crash direction would matter, it would allow wrong-way-drivers to annoy others by driving backwards. Maybe the best alternative would be to make the disabled cars ghosts.
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Re: Pro Rules Too Strict
PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:28 pm Reply with quote
Guest
 


Ande wrote:

It is really hard to define what is meaned by "blocking all the time". If crash direction would matter, it would allow wrong-way-drivers to annoy others by driving backwards. Maybe the best alternative would be to make the disabled cars ghosts.

Right... I mean if the other crashes into you from behind you will be disabled if that happens about 5 times. But being disabled on the first crash from behind is a little bit hard.

Though it really doen't disturb me as I'm not overlapped so often. Smile
PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 3:48 pm Reply with quote
Taxmgr
 
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 5


I suppose I'm ok with being ghosted if pro rules feels I'm just "in the way" of the other more experienced drivers. I admit I'm not as good as most drivers. I'm a 44-yr old man with more important priorities than becoming a world champion Turbo Slider driver. However, when there are 19 other drivers in the same race, it is very easy to become a lap down early because of all the congestion on the track. In order to not be disabled, I would just have to move over and basically quit "racing". Are pro rules designed to prevent the occasional jerk from driving backwards, etc. or is it also designed to get us less experienced drivers from getting in others' way. I haven't been in too many online races yet, but I have seen occasions where 25% of the drivers have been disabled. I'm confident that in those races in which I was involved, they were not driving backwards, but just trying to get better at this marvelous game and competing as hard as they could. That was the case with me, and I was getting infuriated.

This issue and the lack of online drivers at the times I like to race are the only reasons I haven't purchased the full version yet. I like to race during 7-10pm CST USA. I'm sure I'll buy the game as $12.95 is a fantastic price for so much fun. I want to make sure I get it before the price goes up next month.

Merry Christmas to all who believe and celebrate this precious Holiday.
Peace be with you!
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 4:09 pm Reply with quote
Ande
 
Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 121


Taxmgr wrote:
Are pro rules designed to prevent the occasional jerk from driving backwards, etc. or is it also designed to get us less experienced drivers from getting in others' way.


The main reason is to prevent backward driving. It was unbelieveably popular in version 0.86. There were times where one couldn't find a server where there wouldn't be 1-2 jerks driving backwards and destroying everyone else's fun.

Whether pro mode is on or off can be switched in the server settings. Perhaps some US servers could be made non-pro at least as long as there aren't backward drivers. Hopefully, there will be more US players in the future. I understand that advertising is only beginning right now. Everyone can of course help by telling about the game to everyone Smile.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2004 3:31 pm Reply with quote
JayTee
 
Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Location: UK


I think the biggest problem with pro-rules is how easy it is for you to get disabled when being lapped. I think it's enough to put off alot of new players and should be done away with completely.

I've never been DQd but well over a dozen people have been DQd after hitting me, and not one of them deserved it.

edit: i didnt know how proRules worked when i posted this.
___

Is it possible to detect if a car is going the wrong way around a track? After a quater of a lap backwards you should be disabled AND ghosted

Similarly, if a car doesn't move far enough along the track ( eg sitting sideways across it and moving backwards and forwards to block people, i've seen it happen Rolling Eyes ) for, say, 20 seconds, then they should should be dq'd and ghosted.

pehaps every other "foul" should just disable your car for 10 seconds or something.
___

another idea:

Instead of being disabled, they should be ghosted. If you get ghosted you don't get any cup points for that race.


hopefuly, paying players won't be such arseholes and no-one will need to enable pro-rules on their server.


Last edited by JayTee on Wed Jan 19, 2005 5:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:51 am Reply with quote
JayTee
 
Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Location: UK


Bump Wink

I seriously think this is the biggest hurdle for new players.

I've seen many people becoming unhappy after getting disabled since i last posted.

I'd prefer it if nothing at all happened to people who are just slow, and who aren't trying to get in the way, but thinking about it, having them turn to ghosts* and still being able to play seems the easiest and most effective way of doing it.

If I've got enough of a lead i'll wait for a space before going in front of any back-marker, and i always feel guilty if i PR them.

*as suggested by Andre before me
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 5:32 am Reply with quote
Guest
 


I personally find the disabled cars bringing an interesting twist to the driving.

Of course getting disabled right in the beginning can be really annoying to
new drivers (possible buyers of the full version). Seen many such comments
especially on the Playtrix demo server. On the other hand, there are almost
no jerks harassing other players on full-ver servers.

Getting disabled->turning to ghost and continuing to play sounds interesting.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 5:34 am Reply with quote
Thunderer
 
Joined: 02 Jan 2005
Posts: 5
Location: Soumi


My post above.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 5:02 am Reply with quote
JayTee
 
Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Location: UK


Anonymous wrote:
Of course getting disabled right in the beginning can be really annoying to
new drivers (possible buyers of the full version). Seen many such comments
especially on the Playtrix demo server.

excactly man. I've seen many people quit in disgust after getting DQ'd many times in a row.

It does work as a moron filter though. People who don't realize it's a learing curve just bugger off, heh. But i want this game to get really popular.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 7:29 am Reply with quote
captainpotato
 
Joined: 02 Jan 2005
Posts: 16
Location: Adelaide, Australia


A few ideas:

1. How about ghosting cars after they have been lapped? Okay, this may be an issue in a close sub-race between backmarkers, but then at least they won't be in the way of the leaders. Is it possible to ghost only some cars, or would this have to be implemented (I suspect this is the case)?

2. What about disabling cars that spend too long (over five seconds, for instance) going to wrong way (forwards or in reverse) that then collide with other cars?

3. Another idea - slow down cars for a few seconds for the first two impacts (unless they breach 2.) and on the third or fourth crash then disable/ghost them? If they are already a lap down, then the slowing down won't cost them a win, and if they were having a close battle with another car, then it teaches them a few race manners Smile Something like the way GP3 slows cars down that jump a chicane or cut a corner.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 8:52 am Reply with quote
Mike Nike
 
Joined: 30 Oct 2004
Posts: 62
Location: Germany


@captainpotato

1. Ghosting cars maybe one solution and lapped players won't have the need anymore to make place for faster cars and keep their line. This garantees a better challenge between slower drivers.
Maybe this solution can be combined with my suggestion to Ande, that the lapped car will get a "blue flag" or another visual information, to get sure, the car behind is faster...
When the car behind is near enough, it will appear as ghost for the player.
Though there might be some special cases, where it might be hard to have a clean solution of this overlapping/bwdriverprevent procedure.

2.
Quote:
[...] (over five seconds, for instance) going to wrong way (forwards or in reverse) that then collide with other cars?

Like Ande would say: unfortunately it is hard to detect wrong way drivers.
The problem is: the track editor allows tracks, where the line, you drive, is even crossing lines, where you collide others, which are 5 seconds behind you. For example a "figure-eight"-track.
Or: the checklines are so far from each other, that reaching the checkline 6 from 5 would take 10 seconds, and before you are crossing checkline 4, 3 and 2 again, for some reason due to the track design.
If you want to detect, if the driver, which just want to reach checkline 6 you can't for example say: if the car is not getting closer to the checkline within 5 seconds, he is driving backwards.
The objects placed in the track can make you trouble for detecting backwarddrivers...
For example: you cross checkline 1...left and right there are walls at the road, you drive a straight for 10 seconds, then there is a 180 degrees turn, and you have to drive 10 seconds back parallel to where you came from. Then you cross checkline 2, which is logically placed parallel to checkline 2. But on the way to checkline 2 from 1, you spent 10 seconds with driving visually away from checkline 2. And when you turn and come nearer to checkline 2...how can be detected if you are driving already on the right way, because it can be also, that you just turned and you drive back to checkline 1 and hurting other cars :-/

And the programer Ande, can't trust, that all track editors would place checklines in a way, which would allow him to create certain wrongwaydriver-detection. So, he has to think about other solutions, how to mind wrong way drivers.

3.
Quote:
Another idea - slow down cars for a few seconds

That was in generally main thoughts about the disable-feature. In some situations it might be nice, if a car would have just for example 2 seconds no possibility to accelerate (and maybe he becomes ghost in these seconds).
Here are again the problems: wrongway drivers have more chances etc., situation must be detected and that wouldn't be easy...
and, what isn't a big problem actually, when a "ghosted" car would become normal after 2 seconds again, then it would maybe "in" another car, when it is overlapping that. So: it would be maybe so long ghost, until it isn't anymore overlapping another car, for example.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 10:54 pm Reply with quote
Ande
 
Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 121


Mike Nike described well why it is hard to detect wrong-way driving. And if you only get disabled for some time and then can continue, this would make the job of wrong-way-drivers much easier again. The current system seems to have been quite effective in that matter - a couple of times I have seen someone try it but they have pretty soon quit as they find out what happens. Old 0.86 players can remember how much pain they could cause in past...

But yes, the bad thing still is that good-willing players may also get disabled. Ghosting or something might be done in the future, but so far, we have to cope with this Sad.
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Pro Rules Too Strict
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